Some Grohk change



  • I didn't try the PTS I don't know if Grohk receive some change.
    I want to add some feature to Grohk like :

    • Add a warning reticle to show were is the Totem and the duration remaining, like the reticle when an ally die.

    • When Grohk die the Totem no longer disappear.

    • Health 2200 -> 2300HP

    [Abilities]

    Lightning Staff

    • You have now 1s to retouch an enemy before the bonus damage disappear.

    Healing Totem

    • Decrease cooldown 15s ->13s
    • Decrease duration 6s -> 5s
    • Increase radius 20 -> 25 units
    • Increase health 1000 -> 2000 HP (1500)

    We can destroy the Totem, so 6s can be useless, with the change the Totem will be better.

    Ghost Walk

    This abilitie suck cause can be too stronge with a burst heal, but now with the nerf of the Support I think we can up this abilitie.

    • Reduce cooldown 12s -> 11s
    • Increase duration 1s -> 1.5s (1.2s)
    • Increase movement speed 20% -> 40%

    [Talents]

    Totemic Ward

    Increase the Healing done by Healing Totem by 30% -> 25% and allies Healed by Healing Totem gain Immunity to Crowd Control for 2s -> 1.5s

    Spirit's Domain

    NEW : "The basic radius of Healing Totem increase by 200%, but heal 33% less."

    Now the radius is 75 units and can be again increase of 125% by Outreach, at the end the totem has a radius of 168,75 units. The Healing Totem heal now for 280HP per second, but you can increase the Heal with Healing Rain.

    [Cards]

    Astral Traveler : Increase your Movement Speed while using Ghost Walk by {25|25}% -> {20|20}%

    Crackle : Increase the duration of Healing Totem by {0.6|0.6}s -> {0.5|0.5}s

    Monolith Totem : OLD : Increase the Health of Healing Totem by {250|250}HP.
    NEW : Reduce the cooldown of Healing Totem by {0.8|0.8}s when it's destroy.

    Gale : OLD : Decrease the Cooldown of Healing Totem by {1|1}s after activating Ghost Walk.
    NEW : Activate Ghost Walk give back {200|200}HP to the Healing Totem.

    Shamanic Might : Increase your maximum Health by {100|100} -> {75|75}.

    [Updated 3th of January]



  • The Totem needs some form of time duration countdown for allies HUD in order to get a reading of the duration of the totem from afar.



  • @Buongiornooo Seem funny 😉



  • I can talk forever about Grohk and other supports as a support main and the buffs/nerfs they need. Most supports need a fucking buff, but they won't get one.

    Grohk is in need of some major buffs. He can't heal long range and his healing totem, can easily be destroyed. Kinessa and Strix can one shot his base totem without getting bulldozer. His totem needs to have 3,000 health at base. Bulldozer is just too cheap and damage is too high to not buff it. His totem needs to have a base cooldown of 12 seconds, and gale should just reduce it without needing to use your escape. So he can have a minimum cooldown of 7 seconds without Chronos. His totem's range needs to increase by 50 units at base, but nerf the increase card (I think they're doing this actually).

    Now for his healing, he needs to have Spirit's Domain in his base kit, but a severely nerfed version. Basically he would be the opposite of Io. Io's main heal is her bow, but the dog is an extra heal (that heal should be in her base kit, but a nerfed version as well), Grohk's totem would be his main heal, while his staff would just be an extra ranged heal. Totem Ward would still give 30% extra healing and cc immunity, but shock pulse bounces would also heal. Get rid of Spirit's Domain and bring back Wraith or some new talent centered around his Ghost Walk.

    Now for his utility. He needs to have a 50% slow on shock pulse in his base kit, but it would be removed for Maelstrom to compensate for the extra damage and spamming of shock pulses.

    Grohk needs a lot of work, but he won't get much because you have people Platinum and below complaining that he's OP and hard to go against, while people in higher elo only see him as damage and are fine with that.



  • Disclaimer... I am not a support. I AM THE TEAM TANK ENGINE.

    I'm still thinking that maelstrom needs a slight nerf, in order for the rest of Grohks kit to get a buff up around shock orb.

    Personally the biggest issue he faces is his Shock Pulse Cool Down at base. As soon as a big boi or sitting ducky deployable walks in the frame of maelstrom... grohk generates so much ult charge off that shock bounce that his ult can make many powerplays across the game. But without maelstrom, grohks pulse has no impact and fails to generate much ult charge. Just cutting the CD of shock orb to 3-4s and reducing the reset values of maelstrom to stay similar to their current feeling would be great to allow grohks other talents to sustain better base ult generation over the game by landing more shock orbs into groups, over ult charge off healing.

    Totem HP.... how big is a barik turret nowadays. And the dynamics behind its deactivation on death could be greatly improved. Grohks totem needs to merit some use of dozer, even by snipers standards. If it was given a better CD time and base area, it would not have to have juggernaught HP like luna, but it still needs to make a player with 1k damage attacks, take a couple of shots or invest in dozer. The issue with its duration, is that pushing beyond probs 8s would be too extreme for the CC immunity value given more totem durability. The totem needs a small reset dynamic where it gets a bonus is if it is not destroied within the duration.



  • @HeartQueen I increase to 1600 HP, I think it's enough. Can seem weak but do you think a sniper will focus the Totem ? I don't think so, and the Totem can be protect by the Tank on the point.



  • @Buongiornooo said in Some Grohk change:

    @Pi3rre07
    For the totem, I actually would like to see the opposite 😂
    More duration, more radius, a lot more HP but also more cooldown. That's only my opinion ofc, I don't know about you guys.
    I always thought that the totem should be a big source of healing that needs to be foussed and destroyed (with the help of bulldozer), not a small circe that lasts only a few seconds and can be destroyed easly.
    Something like io's fox that however doesn't deal damage or stun and has a limited but long duration, like 30/40 seconds... it would be even cooler if the totem could be moved 1 or 2 times during its duration... you know, so that if you place it on point and you want to help a flank route, you move it there.

    About ghost walk, a 0.2 sec buff isn't going to improve anything, it would still be too short and weak to escape in some situations, and players would still be forced to max it with cards at least to 2 sec.
    It should be atleast 1.5 tbh

    Io's Fox and the totem are two different things though. The Fox isn't Io's main source of healing, even if you put Life Link in the base kit which I think they should do, but provide a nerfed version (like healing for 100 per second instead of 300). Grohk's totem IS his main source of healing. Plus Grohk can't heal his totem. If it has a long cooldown like Io's, assuming you mean 18 seconds, this will make Grohk even worse as a healer. Totemic Ward is only for really good support players that know good totem placement, know how to build good loadouts, know priority items, and how to manage his rotations. This will make Totemic Ward even worse!

    I can see why they won't increase the duration, they're worried about the deathball meta coming back. Grohk's totem heals in ticks consistently, plus grants cc immunity with some talents. That would be a lot of healing, especially with the upcoming nerf to caut.

    @Pi3rre07 said in Some Grohk change:

    @HeartQueen I increase to 1600 HP, I think it's enough. Can seem weak but do you think a sniper will focus the Totem ? I don't think so, and the Totem can be protect by the Tank on the point.

    Any sniper with a decent amount of game sense absolutely will! 3000 is a bit extreme with the nerf to bulldozer. I was thinking more in line with bulldozer now, which isn't healthy to the upcoming balance, but I won't except anything lower than 2000 hp in his base kit. In return, nerf the cards that increase the health from {250|250} to {50|50}, that way he won't have more than 2250 hp totem just like he has now. This is the perfect balance so that he isn't technically buffed as far as max potential, but some of the strength of his cards is put into his base kit. That way, only Kinessa and Strix can 2 shot his totem without bulldozer, the way it should be. Take in mind that Grohk can't even heal his totem, so once they shoot it down, it's gone. I like the idea of a shorter cooldown, but with my idea. Gale would provide the cooldown without using your escape, so from 13 second cooldown to an 8 second cooldown with the max card.



  • @HeartQueen said in Some Grohk change:

    I can talk forever about Grohk and other supports as a support main and the buffs/nerfs they need. Most supports need a fucking buff, but they won't get one.

    Grohk is in need of some major buffs. He can't heal long range and his healing totem, can easily be destroyed. Kinessa and Strix can one shot his base totem without getting bulldozer. His totem needs to have 3,000 health at base. Bulldozer is just too cheap and damage is too high to not buff it. His totem needs to have a base cooldown of 12 seconds, and gale should just reduce it without needing to use your escape. So he can have a minimum cooldown of 7 seconds without Chronos. His totem's range needs to increase by 50 units at base, but nerf the increase card (I think they're doing this actually).

    Now for his healing, he needs to have Spirit's Domain in his base kit, but a severely nerfed version. Basically he would be the opposite of Io. Io's main heal is her bow, but the dog is an extra heal (that heal should be in her base kit, but a nerfed version as well), Grohk's totem would be his main heal, while his staff would just be an extra ranged heal. Totem Ward would still give 30% extra healing and cc immunity, but shock pulse bounces would also heal. Get rid of Spirit's Domain and bring back Wraith or some new talent centered around his Ghost Walk.

    Now for his utility. He needs to have a 50% slow on shock pulse in his base kit, but it would be removed for Maelstrom to compensate for the extra damage and spamming of shock pulses.

    Grohk needs a lot of work, but he won't get much because you have people Platinum and below complaining that he's OP and hard to go against, while people in higher elo only see him as damage and are fine with that.

    Hmm... I was too extreme here and I thought of a new idea. Get rid of Spirit's Domain altogether. You still can't heal the flank with only 120 unit range unless you chase them. Especially on long maps. I would actually put shock pulse healing in his base kit, but with a few changes. If you hit an enemy with it, it'll be the normal effect of damage and bouncing, but with a 50% slow. That slow would go away with Maelstrom though. If you hit an ally, it'll heal for a burst 500 health, this affect will go away with Maelstrom. Lower shock pulses base cooldown to 4 seconds. Then have a card that provides {20%|20%} healing to yourself if you hit an ally instead of an enemy. Basically similar to Pip where you have self healing when you go damage, and self healing when you go healer.

    Replace Spirit's Domain with Wraith or something else. I don't know, but Spirit's Domain needs to go.

    Maelstrom, to compensate will only get a cooldown reduction of 1 second (so 3 second cooldown), bounces 4 more times, and does 50-100 more damage (so 200-250 damage per bounce). 50 more is optional in case 100 more is too broken.

    That would make Grohk viable, but not broken. The reason Grohk is out of the meta, despite giving cc immunity, is because he can't heal at range. The shock pulse heal will make his heal at range require skill. It won't be as much as Ying's because his totem provides a bunch of healing, but it won't be small. A 500 heal every 4 seconds with a range of up to 300 units is good; every 2.8 seconds with Chronos 3. He'll be in a good spot.



  • @HeartQueen said in Some Grohk change:

    In return, nerf the cards that increase the health from {250|250} to {50|50}, that way he won't have more than 2250 hp totem just like he has now.

    This card will become totally useless, maybe change this card by a card which reduce the CD of the Healing Totem when it's destroy.



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  • @Pi3rre07 said in Some Grohk change:

    @HeartQueen said in Some Grohk change:

    In return, nerf the cards that increase the health from {250|250} to {50|50}, that way he won't have more than 2250 hp totem just like he has now.

    This card will become totally useless, maybe change this card by a card which reduce the CD of the Healing Totem when it's destroy.

    I like that idea. Really, every deployable based support should get a card like that in my opinion. Though Grohk and Io's would be percent based because their cooldown is long compared to Ying's.

    Every support should also be able to heal at range. Grover for example can heal in his normal kit close range, but his ult should be map wide like Ying's. Like I said, I can make a whole topic about what every support needs. lol. Yet everyone seems to really hate them and want to buff them. So annoying and hypocritical. You have the people on the forums sayings they shouldn't heal so much, but in the actual game they're spamming us like crazy for heals!



  • @HeartQueen If every support can heal at long range, they would no longer much distinction between them. For exemple on Bazaar Grover can be better than Seris and the opposite on an other map.



  • @Pi3rre07 said in Some Grohk change:

    @HeartQueen If every support can heal at long range, they would no longer much distinction between them. For exemple on Bazaar Grover can be better than Seris and the opposite on an other map.

    Every support should be able to, but not at the same frequencies or all the time. Really, every ally, except Grover and Ying, should heal for at least 150 units at base. In return, Ying has Life Exchange that allows her to heal allies at ANY range, and her map wide ult. Grover should get the same in return. Low distance heal in his base kit and a potential max of 90 units, but he'll get a map wide ult that can heal allies no matter how far they are. Unlike most other supports, it'll only be during his ult. Grohk in my balance would be able to heal allies up to 300 units away, but would lose it with Maelstrom (the damage talent), and can only heal far away allies if he makes it to them in time with his ult.

    That way supports are still different and not too similar, but they still have options. I still don't see Grover being meta with this change because it's only during his ult, but he'll be stronger. Grover also needs more synergy in his kit. Long range attacks and short range heals? Mal'Damba is the opposite. Grover needs to deal 450 damage close range and 750 at long range. That'll make him a better damage at close ranges, while staying true to his sniper playstyle. Mal'Damba needs a nerfed version of Wekono's Curse in his base kit. Instead of mending spirits dealing 560 over 2 seconds (280 per second), mending spirits can deal 400 over 2 seconds (200 per second). That way he can have a long ranged hit scan attack. lol. Like I said, it can literally write an essay about how to balance supports. Sad that people want them nerfed so hard.


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