100% Bonus MS Maeve ...

  • @Musiicy tbh I haven't played the new update yet because my TV is broken so don't take my opinion too seriously for now, but besides cat burglar bring a bit too much in the hands of someone who can actually aim with her, I don't see her movement speed as a problem because her entire kit and personality revolves around being swift, the problem is almost everyone else is so slow a bloody crippled old WW2 vet could outrun them with nimble 1.

    In other words, buff the rest of the roster instead of nerfing the few remaining characters that don't feel like they're being weighed down by the guilt of all the murder and violence they've commited.

  • Really the key is and you stated it already that she cannot fight at that movement speed bonus. You are also correct that that normal prowl is so easy to hit that you cannot escape anything with it. That is why most people including me run at least level 3 or 4 on the increased speed in prowl other wise the skill is only for chasing and not for escaping. they should increase the base on prowl and reduce the card so its not so mandatory. I can say that as a person that has played allot of Maeve she doesnt have the burst of other flanks so it makes since that she has other skills that she excels at.

    The new cool down reduction card is about the same as Andro card that gives 2.5 seconds off per shot so i dont see it as being a problem. I do think that her damage legendary after prowl needs to be reduced to 20%.

    I cant tell you how many times i have prowled with 40% card and been bursted down mid air from half health.
    What keeps prowl balanced is that you cant do anything. You cant use any abilites you can do shit while its active.
    Also Maeve has 1900 HP she is super squishy. She is like Evie, her mobility is the only reason she is not dead all the time.

  • @shadowchess You're making a fair point. Then what about something like this:

    • Increase Prowl's bonus MS from 50% to 80%
    • Increase Max Health from 1900 to 2000 (let's not forget she has a HP card)
    • Increase Nine Lives heal from 400 to 500
    • Increase Patch Up (Q) additional heal from {80 | 80} to {100 | 100}
    • Either reduce Chase bonus MS increase from {10% | 10%} to {4% | 4%} or rework it into another card (flat CD ? Partial CD reset on Pounce ? Increase Jump Height bonus ?)

    My point with these potential changes would be to:

    • Make Prowl's speed bonus more consistent, but not a 100%, because it still feels obnoxious to me
    • Make Chase not mandatory anymore
    • Replace the lost mobility with actual worthy healing on Nine Lives (and idk but if the player didn't press Q to heal because he absolutely wanted the Pounce reset, and ends up being bursted down, that's his mistake. with that said, that heal is currently laughable so it could definitely use a buff) and also some extra HP.

    I think you raised the actual real issue:
    Maeve is too squishy and doesn't have as good tools to survive as others flanks do.
    Raw speed is her only way to survive, and it sucks to me. But that's just how I happen to think of it ^^

    Edit: I read your answer once again and it occured to me that another option could do very well ...

    • Rework Chase
    • Allow Maeve to shoot / use abilities during Prowl
    • Adjust Prowl's bonus MS according to that

  • @Musiicy shes ez to deal with, believe me,
    Im a lvl 53 m-Maeve and I never used this card at lvl 5, I do use it in every of my decks, its indeed a very good card, but believe me, there are way better movement abilities in the game, and again prowl needs skill to get on top if things and a lot of map knowledge. Evie has way more mobility with a pounce-like teleport (that can be used twice with wormhole) and soar that stays pretty long and moves you pretty much everywhere in the map, then theres kinessa that has a teleport with a pretty big range and a card that buffs it out to 135% MS after she used it. Pls dont make the game slow and boring as hell, I dont want to see champs like Evie and Maeve ending up with the same MS as a frickin Makoa.
    One more thing tho, Im a guy who likes off meta champs and champs that are high skill dependent, I dont like playing busted champions like Strix, Cassie and Lian, and Maeve is starting to feel a bit too strong to my thought, I just hope they wont buff her even more otherwise they will nerf her to the ground which is very likely to happen.

  • @Carlolrac555 "ez to deal with" really depends on who you are playing ...

    • surely this is not true for blasters. Hitting a flying Maeve who's under Prowl's effect as Drogoz, Dredge or Bomb King is almost not humanly doable.
    • Any champion who doesn't have vertical mobility, and/or has strong damage falloff will have a hard time dealing significant damage to her (Tyra, Koga, Talus, Buck, Ruckus)
    • Lastly, some specific crucial things are just unnecessarily hard to hit on her specifically (Damba Stun, 4 Seris orbs for Stun, even point-blank Furia Q with increased radius is easily dodgeable as Maeve)

    I won't take away from you that Maeve has a high skill floor, I also agree with the comparition between her mobility and Evie's.
    Also, Evie undoubtedly has more survivability thanks to Ice Block and Wormhole, alongside more freedom to move around the map thanks to Soar.

    With that being said, Daggers and Ice Staff are nowhere close to be comparable.
    Daggers can be used in a stupid way where all you have to do is pick a high spot and spam them from above. They are undodgeable for most champions because they travel really fast, and rare are the abilities in this game, that can block projectiles coming from above.
    Also, Maeve doesn't always have to put herself in danger to deal damage. She eventually needs to do it to kill, but that is it. Evie seriously can't do that. She has to go danger-close to be efficient at all.
    Evie needs to reload pretty often, and has to take care of not running ammoless mid-fight. Maeve doesn't care.
    Evie's ult is unbearable, but she still has to take risks to make it worth; Maeve's ult is god-tier and only gets countered by coordinated play and voice chat (even then, easier to say than do)
    Finally, hitting people consistently with Ice Staff takes a thousand more skill than with Daggers. At least it is past Gold, where people aren't all still learning to handle their keyboard and mouse at the same time.

    How could Kinessa even come to your mind ? Same issue here, IMO hitting consistently as Kinessa is stupidly more mechanical than shooting Daggers.
    Her blink is an easy escape, but it usually forces her out of the fight for a while, which means you already did your job.
    Also, in a lot of scenarios, she then has to wait 10s for her Teleporter to come off cooldown to be able to snipe once again, because a lot of her good spots, she can only access by blinking to them.

    On what platform, and at what elo do you play ? Because that could eventually explain why we such different visions of these things.

  • @Musiicy All those changes just make her way better.

  • @Musiicy You do not want a maeve that can shoot during prowl, only thing worse than maeve diving you to kill you is her running away and not being punished for it.

    I could see the legendary for prowl changing from 30% damage, to the first dagger in prowl does not cancel prowl.

    More reasonable would be 70 percent during prowl
    Change the chase card to 6% per level
    You cannot give her more health so long as she has that health card

    I was once in your exact spot as Maeve was just owning me. I could not deal with her. I played her for about a month straight and learned enough that i no longer have issues dealing with her.

  • @OriginalEquinox said in 100% Bonus MS Maeve ...:

    @Musiicy know what else she has though? One of the highest skill requirements in the game, which probably isn't saying much considering most of the roster was built with kindergartners in mind but my point still stands, not every Tom, Dick and Harry can do good with her just because she has a few movement speed cards in her loadout unlike say Vivian who has bonus 30% movement at all times and doesn't require an ounce of thought or skill to play

    That doesn't mean Maeve should be OP though. I hate the argument that people should be OP because they take skill to use because it implies the opposite: that characters shouldn't be viable because they don't take much skill. Seris needs a buff, yet according to this logic, she doesn't deserve one because she's easy to use. Not saying she should have as much utility and healing as Mal'Damba, but she deserves more than she currently has.

  • @HeartQueen this argument could go in circles but it'll never really be fixed until they start balancing the game separately for PC and consoles. On PS4 even with crossplay I can count on one hand how many skilled Maeve players I've gone against. I know projectile and high mobility characters like Maeve, Evie or Cassie are cancer on PC but nerfing them will make them useless on console just like buffing hitscans for PC makes them more cancer on console.

    Can't really comment on Seris since I've rarely played her since the HP nerfs. She used to be a balanced character able to defend herself while also healing but they had to kill her because some flank mains didn't want to buy resilience to counter her stun so now the only viable build she has is the mortal reach one which sucks, I quite enjoyed flank Seris lol