Zhin Talent Changes



  • All three talents. Need something of a change. I know we'll see Smolder nerfs and Guillotine Nerfs, but I find it harsh for Zhin to not have a good Yomi anymore... So, here's some random ideas... All for talents.


    Guillotine:

    Idea #1. No longer causes your ult to charge faster. Return 25% Damage Reduction when ulting.

    Idea #2. Every hit of Spite now executes enemies under 65% health, but Spite only deals 200 damage. Also causes your ultimate to charge 15% faster.

    comments: This means that he can kill people before he even hits him with all 5 Guillotine hits, without it being too broken.


    Yomi: Oh boy. This talent went from best to worst in a single patch. (to be fair Barik's Tinkerin and Makoa's Leviathan went the same... but... you get the idea)

    • Idea #1: Your heavy hit with Inferno Blade now deals 350 increased damage, but no longer pierces enemies.

    comments: Makes Zhin much more burstier, but it reverses the Yomi effect.

    • Idea #2: Your first two hits with Inferno blade deals 50 more damage, and your Heavy hit deals 150 more damage.

    comments a bit too much of a direct buff, but makes Yomi less useless.

    • Idea #3: Your heavy hit now applies a burn effect dealing 240 damage over 3 seconds. This is refreshed with each hit.

    comments: Potentially busted... But fun since the burn reveals enemies.


    Smolder: Unchanged.

    This would buff a powerful champion anyway... but umm... I know this needs to be placed along with Billow, Hideout, Fan The Flames, or whirl nerfs... so... Thoughts?



  • @Demigod Zhin does not need more damage !!!

    The talents are doing the wrong things...

    • He does not need more sustain

    • He does not need more damage

    Utility is what his talents should offer

    Talent Ideas that provide play style changes without making him broken

    • Guillotine now can be used at 50% ult charge, Spite now does two swings of 500 damage each...

    • Billow no longer puts zhin in smoke form, it teleports zhin 50 units up and resets whirl...

    • Whirl has two charges but now only does 200 damage...



  • Personaly i wouldn't change guillotine, but if it had to be changed i would go for idea 2.
    Yomi is sooo useless now it needs to change asap. I like idea 2 and 3. I like piercing enemies with heavy hit too much to give it up. Yomi idea 3 could be nice as too many enemies get away from me with like...50 HP left and reveal could be fun too.
    Smolder is okay, but i don't choose it very often, i used to play it a lot before Zhin's billow got nerfed (like...half a year ago).



  • @shadowchess I perfectly agree with Zhin needing more utility in his kit... But at his current state giving him too much utility when he's bloated and busted like this might break him.

    Instead my ideas for Guillotine and Yomi just makes Yomi less useless, and Guillotine a bit less die hard.

    I think it would be nice if he gets a tidbit of nerfs on certain cards (E.G. Fan the Flames, Blade Dancer, Hideout) before giving him utility based talents.



  • @Demigod

    That is why my ideas dont really provide without taking away

    Guillotine now can be used at 50% ult charge, Spite now does two swings of 500 damage each... This turns his ult into a 1000 damage ult...

    So you get double the ults with half the damage. But it also allows him to use his ult as a mobility skill allot more often... I think it offers utility while weaking the ult pretty badly... His normal ult fails to kill people so this one is way less deadly... But you could in theory ult someone twice in a row...

    Whirl has two charges but now only does 200 damage...
    The Whirl gives him more whirl but its damage is halved.

    Billow no longer puts zhin in smoke form, it teleports zhin 50 units up and resets whirl...
    You are losing your immunity for massive dive potential

    All of these add utility while taking away things from him... The ideas you have for yomi would break him, they just add to much damage output for an already easy to land in hand attack.



  • @shadowchess your change for billow is nice in theory, but there are maps where you got roof over your head, like Ascension peak. If you activated billow in the tunnel on the edge of map, it would teleport you into rock, or brightmarsh where zhin would be teleported into roof while inside the buildings there.
    With guillotine card spite can be used on 50% charge is nice, but i think that you gotta give the leg something more. Like...Evie has snowglobe. She can use ult on 50% charge and it deals more dmg but lasts less. So spite can be used on 50% and resets zhin's cooldowns or something like that, but deals less dmg on swing.



  • @methylbenzen Oh its got something great.... He can use his utl at 50% Zhin gets 30% refund when he misses.. So he could use his ult as a mobility skill all over the place.



  • @shadowchess said in Zhin Talent Changes:

    @Demigod Zhin does not need more damage !!!

    The talents are doing the wrong things...

    • He does not need more sustain

    • He does not need more damage

    Utility is what his talents should offer

    Talent Ideas that provide play style changes without making him broken

    • Guillotine now can be used at 50% ult charge, Spite now does two swings of 500 damage each...

    • Billow no longer puts zhin in smoke form, it teleports zhin 50 units up and resets whirl...

    • Whirl has two charges but now only does 200 damage...

    I agree to a certain extent. I would be down for optional vertical mobility for Zhin, but he isn't invincible for 2 seconds during Billow. Not a fan of ult talents. I prefer the whirl has 2 charges one over the ult one. The third one should be a damage talent though. A not broken retaliation. Like you deal 15% more damage.

    Then nerf the cards that reset counter and billow. Nerf the counter card from {15|15}%-->{10|10}% Nerf the Billow card from {20|20}%-->{10|10}% and from killing blows to eliminations. That way he isn't spamming his sustain and damage. The problem isn't that he does too much damage, but it's that he doesn't seem to die. I would love to see more optional utility and even damage, but less invulnerability. Or at least, it shouldn't be spammed as easily.



  • @HeartQueen I know that it seems like zhin has low damage based on his raw nimbers. But he doesnt miss... Every shot he fires hits you... Thats the real issue.... This has the side effect of charging his ult super fast. Ash slug shot has the same thing... Its so easy to hit her shots with that talent that i hit 99% of my shots and 400 seems like trash but its great when you dont miss.

    They need to reduce the width of his first two swings by 75% or make his shots have damage fall off based on how much of the shot hits you so aiming is a thing.



  • I would reduce the length of all swings by 75% and then make one of the talents increase the lenght by 50%



  • @shadowchess nah man, if he uses ult below 100% he gets his current ult charge minus 50% no matter what. If he uses ult on 100% and misses he gets 30% back.

    So if zhin ults with like 78% after ulting he gets 28%, if he ults with 50% he gets 0% after ulting. I think this could work.


Log in to reply