Choosing a Point Tank


  • PC

    Some random mid to high skill tank main here telling you who to play point and with what build.

    In all seriousness, this is a struggle among newer tank players it seems. A struggle of "who can I make work point" and "who can't I make work." Of course somebody who's new enough to the role may think "any tank will do right?" Nope. I will say though as well, it's more than the three that are meta that are viable options, and all of them have their own reasons to pick them. Here is a tier list I have made, accurate as of 3.3, for all tanks potential viability in the point portion of the role.

    Point Options.jpg

    Terminus- Term is absolutely the best tank in the game, and point is where he really shines. His melee range serves him well in contesting objectives and warding enemies away from them within that range. His siphon affords him massive sustain, and even good ranged damage with a Decimation build (which are the meta builds). Crush can also work pretty well with the right setup into the right matchups, but for most players I would reccomend going a Decimation build at this particular point in time. The loadout itself is just so broken. Term is a good point tank for you if you want to play a tank who can easily perform, but is also very fun and (surprisingly) mechanical. Though I wouldn't recommend him if you don't like having to get into the faces of your opponents.

    • Loadout I Use: (Decimation)- Necromantic Might V, Hulking Monstrosity IV, Abomination III, Devastation II, Powerslave I
    • Good Item Choices: Nimble, Blue, Morale Boost, Master Riding/Bulldozer/2nd Blue

    Barik- Barik is definitely up there as well in terms of point tank options. His turrets allow him to easily zone the area around an objective, and his Blunderbuss gives him a very solid close range option. His small hurtbox and good mobility for a tank gives him the ability to quite easily kite out damage, and he has the loadout cards to really utilize it. He has two solid talents in Architectonics and Fortify and each build quite differently and even play a little bit differently. Architectonics focuses on making the most use you can out of your turrets, giving you CDR on your turrets as well as giving them more value by making them deal a seemingly small amount of extra damage that adds up over the course of the match. Fortify on the other hand encourages more shield-centric play where you'll try for as much uptime on it as feasibly possible, while still of course maintaining the core Barik has on either loadout. Architectonics is generally the better of the two, but the choice is ultimately yours. Barik is a good point tank to play for a DPS player who wants to fill for it, or for somebody that doesn't want to overburden their support.

    • Loadout I Use: (Architectonics)- Brave and Bold IV, Field Deploy/Double Time IV, Failsafe III, One Man's Treasure II, Forged Alloy II
    • Good Item Choices: Master Riding, Cauterize, Nimble/Resilience

    NOTE: Not updating my guide to account for the slight change in build here. I'm sick and tired the flak that guide gets simply because people decide they know how to play the character better when they have way less credentials.


    Inara- Honestly Inara as a tank is pretty mediocre (off point she's unviable), but she still is number 3 point-wise. She is honestly my second least played tank (to Torvald) because I find her boring, but I suppose that doesn't matter with her too much. Outside of wall, Inara pretty much requires zero mechanical skill... Part of her appeal I suppose. She also gets DR for just using her right click, easily gets value out of good healing supports, and she can pressure point with Warder's Field. Not to mention she can block flank routes with her wall. I've seen a lot of people saying Mother's Grace is a great talent on her and while usable into certain matchups, it's by no means a great talent simply because of the fact that Rejuvenate is so weak as an item at the moment. I'd suggest running Treacherous Ground because it has so much usage at the moment to just cripple (which is great for countering Barik in particular, but definitely does well into other matchups) and force the enemy tanks to focus more on buying Resilience. It also is not quite as easy to just destroy the deployable anymore thanks to the massive nerf to Bulldozer a few patches back. I guess play her if you want to play an easy tank who easily gets healed up and has a way of forcefully cucking the other point by pressing one button... No wonder every other Inara I run into is toxic... Anyways...

    • Loadout I Would Use [Take with a grain of salt]: (Treacherous Ground)- Standing Stones V, Sacred Ground V, Steadfast II, Rolling Stones II, Lodestone I
    • Good Item Choices: Cauterize/Resilience/Rejuvenate (not in order)

    NOTE: For this section if there were somebody else who was more familiar with the character their input would be appreciated. I have a general idea how to play her and make her work but other than that... 🤷


    Ash- Yes, Ash is most certainly is a viable point option. With a shield-oriented build using Fortress Breaker, Ash can quite ably contest point utilizing her knockback. She's a ways better off certainly but as a point tank she can work as long as the Ash player is competent enough to properly utilize the build necessary to make it work. But if you can Ash offers point clutching potential that isn't shared by any other viable point tank option. Also she's the most aggressive point that can work at the moment, that can utilize her kit to disrupt the front line and to ably zone. This isn't to mention that her ult is among the best tank-wise, period, essentially being a Swiss army knife of an ult, though it's generally better used aggressively. There is a reason this build is called a "pseudo" point build, though, as it doesn't quite work at the same level as the top 3 do. This is a good option for you if for some reason you really don't want to play Terminus, yet you want to be an aggressive point, of course I wouldn't pick her over Term/Barik/Inara most of the time as a point tank in ranked though...

    • Loadout I Use: (Fortress Breaker)- Brawl V, Siege Engine IV, Indomitable III, War Machine II, Heavy Metal I
    • Good Item Choices- Cauterize, Morale Boost, Blue/Bulldozer, Blue/Master Riding

    Makoa- Honestly Koa's only viable point because of the combo of Barrier Reef V and Carapace V. Without that he'd just be a plausible. But Koa does have other tools that can be useful to more aggressive comps. His hook can be used to secure kills OR to force somebody into moving away from it and still getting bursted down if your DPSes are competent enough to see that's what you're doing with it. His ultimate is also really good like Ash's, but his ult mainly is used for two reasons: to sustain during a fight, or to block very harmful hard CC mid teamfight. As for his shield, with this build it's among the best shields in the game potentially, BUT this is only if you rush Chronos. Rushing Chronos can get its cooldown to an insanely low amount. This is a good point tank option for you if you have the technical skill to make it work for you, but other than that don't play it. There's a reason he's barely in viable on my tier list.

    • Loadout I Use: (Half Shell)- Carapace V, Barrier Reef V, Strongarm III, Salvage I, Tidal Grace I
    • Good Item Choices- Chronos, Cauterize, Blue/Master Riding/Morale Boost, ""

    Also imagine trying to help people and getting attacked by trolls with inflated egos for doing so.

    ~ To Be Continued



  • Your tierlists. Why you place Raum at "Don't" with Ruckus and Torv? If the other team has no CC he can run circles on the point and there is nothing they can do about it. Torv can do this if the other team does no damage. It's like comparing Hulk with a smurf (sorry Torvald). 😁



  • @Dusklicious said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    if there were somebody else who was more familiar with the character their input would be appreciated

    While cripple circle is a good talent, it is the offtank talent, 50% DR is what makes her so strong as point tank, so since this is a point tank guide, I would suggest writing about this one instead.

    There are many builds for MG, most people use RMB CD and RMB heal and a little HP 3.

    Other variant of MG reminds more of cripple build but still works well, and this is the version I use:

    • HP 5, with 50% DR this is double the value
    • 25% DR with circle, you place it inbeetween RMBs for additional protection
    • RMB heal 3, this is 40% more value due to her RMB increasing heal, and then double value since you have 50% DR on top of all that.
    • RMB CD 1 filler
    • F CD 1 filler

    This makes her extremely difficult to kill with a very bursty healer.

    For Items Chronos works really well with keeping your cds up, nimble is invaluable to counter her self slow as well. Caut is obvious, and then either DR if enemy is 1 dmg type, or reju if you are healed a lot. or MRiding if not and not.

    Resilience is bad since you have CC immunity.



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  • PC

    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    Your tierlists. Why you place Raum at "Don't" with Ruckus and Torv? If the other team has no CC he can run circles on the point and there is nothing they can do about it. Torv can do this if the other team does no damage. It's like comparing Hulk with a smurf (sorry Torvald). 😁

    @M3RC3N4RI0 Raum has no mechanism to hold point with... No shield, no siphon, no nothing. Plus running circles around point isn't even remotely an effective strategy, and would render him completely immobile for a whole 15 more seconds. There's no logical reason to run him point. If you want to run that kind of aggressive point style Ash or Terminus is a far better choice as they both have a way to mitigate damage that doesn't really put them at risk of being out of position. Heck, Atlas has quite a bit more potential point than Raum TBH.

    @TTraw I'm not well-versed with her, but I don't think this is necessarily an accurate assessment. I've ran TG point a few times before and it usually works quite well as long as you have DR and CDR at rank 5 and you can reliably use it to cripple the other point and force them into a bad position where they can't not die. Though it's very interesting to read this post as I only have her mastery 21 at this point (second least for me out of all tanks as mentioned).



  • @Dusklicious said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    @M3RC3N4RI0 Raum has no mechanism to hold point with... No shield, no siphon, no nothing.

    Yeah. Sure. Raum has 50% DR on his run and 25% DR on Soul Harvest with Harbinger and his 2K Soul Armor (immune to wrecker) which he can load up with his gun, that is "nothing".

    I just made an experiment at the shooting range. I placed Raum in front of Cassie 1 while shooting at Cassie 2. With a max DR loadout he can generate so much Soul Armor that he doesn't die (even though Cassie 2 is dead half the time). Cassie has a dps of almost 700 including reload so this is the equivalent of a Seris pocket heal. More than nothing I'd say.


  • PC

    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    @Dusklicious said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    @M3RC3N4RI0 Raum has no mechanism to hold point with... No shield, no siphon, no nothing.

    Yeah. Sure. Raum has 50% DR on his run and 25% DR on Soul Harvest with Harbinger and his 2K Soul Armor (immune to wrecker) which he can load up with his gun, that is "nothing".

    I just made an experiment at the shooting range. I placed Raum in front of Cassie 1 while shooting at Cassie 2. With a max DR loadout he can generate so much Soul Armor that he doesn't die (even though Cassie 2 is dead half the time). Cassie has a dps of almost 700 including reload so this is the equivalent of a Seris pocket heal. More than nothing I'd say.

    Uhm yeah it is when hitting him is insanely easy and cancelling the DR is as simple as CCing him. Not really much more than nothing against competent players.

    Also Tyra's very existence makes the whole argument moot even if it weren't that simple... Because, as I said, he has no shield and no real way to contest because of it.



  • @Dusklicious said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    Uhm yeah it is when hitting him is insanely easy and cancelling the DR is as simple as CCing him. Not really much more than nothing against competent players.
    Also Tyra's very existence makes the whole argument moot even if it weren't that simple... Because, as I said, he has no shield and no real way to contest because of it.

    Tyra. My team has Io and with 40% speed bonus and DR I comfortably walk out of the fire. I was just curious if there is an objective reasoning behind Raum's placement. I don't mind where you put him on your list. No reason to get snippy. 😘


  • PC

    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    @Dusklicious said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    Uhm yeah it is when hitting him is insanely easy and cancelling the DR is as simple as CCing him. Not really much more than nothing against competent players.
    Also Tyra's very existence makes the whole argument moot even if it weren't that simple... Because, as I said, he has no shield and no real way to contest because of it.

    Tyra. My team has Io and with 40% speed bonus and DR I comfortably walk out of the fire. I was just curious if there is an objective reasoning behind Raum's placement. I don't mind where you put him on your list. No reason to get snippy. 😘

    There's plenty of them, to say the least. It's just so counterable, and as I said no shield or anything to block anything with. You'd just be charging ults up for free with no way out when you're hit with CC. Sure it could be more in "plausible" at lower skill, but this isn't designed specifically for low levels of play.



  • @Dusklicious Yeah, and Moji is F-tier cause she has no poke. I know, I know. Fine with me.


  • PC

    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    @Dusklicious Yeah, and Moji is F-tier cause she has no poke. I know, I know. Fine with me.

    Not only that but her ult is pretty terrible and she's easy enough to kill as long as you aren't just soaking damage from her for whatever reason or you just fire into the barrier because why not.

    Also, My tier list doesn't put her remotely that low, because I can acknowledge that within her rather limited range she can be a pretty serious threat.



  • I play cripple inara on point. It works pretty well.

    The main difference is with mothers grace you can just tank a shit ton of damage if your healer is healing the crap out of you.

    With cripple I have to rotate off point like a normal tank between skill cool downs.

    I find that just having the cripple keeps allot of flanks from even attempting to touch point.

    Khan grab, nope
    Ash dash nope
    Terminus stun nope
    Barik dash nope
    Raum run nope

    It makes people have to play away from me like im Terminus.

    I think standind on point using mothers grace and healbot healer is a crappy way to play... The fact that its even viable is sad.



  • @Shadowpuppy The CC immunity of mothers grace can also counter Khan grab and Term stun and Burn monster or BK stun or Seris ult and so on. That's probably why it is so effective. It's boring though, I also prefer the crippling warder.



  • @M3RC3N4RI0 The CC immunity is really good and it does allow you to stand your ground when ults are incoming.


    • Earthen Guard 10 second cool down and last for 5 seconds and only helps you.
      Max cards takes it down to 7.5 seconds

    • Mothers Grace 20% More DR and the real sweetness is the CC immunity


    • Warders Field 12 second cool down and last for 6 seconds and assist everyone on your team.
      Max card takes it down to 7 seconds

    • Treacherous Ground Cripple plus 10 units of size


    I find that when i run Mothers grace the entire planet is on point in my face shooting at me.

    When i run Treacherous Ground tanks are afraid to get to close when they are low health. There is not a Maeve bouncing around my head, viktor his not running up to me. Its much easier to get value out of my wall because people dont want to run around it and get crippled and die.

    • The amount of zoning i can achieve not even using the cripple is flat out better. The ability to just stop an entire team in thier tracks. I can wall of one path and then intercept the team trying to take an alt path to point.

    By far on of the most fun things is to stand in a door way and place a cripple at the corner. You cant walk through people in paladins and if they cant use their movement ability they cant get buy you.



  • The entire post is wrong from start to finish, sorry, wouldn't recommend this to anyone at all.

    -Terminus requires enemies to shoot his siphon when he's on the point, and he requires abomination at 5 go get the maximum potential value out of his charges.
    You see, people just don't shoot your siphon at higher elo.
    on his maps, yes, he gets higher value, on open maps, he just dies as soon as his siphon runs out.
    Term is the best on : Ice mines, Brightmarsh, Jaguar Falls, and Frozen Guard.

    • Inara is better than Barik sustain wise, she's also better than Terminus since she isn't map dependant, why in the world would you play Treacherous Grounds?? do you really want to have no talent late game OR have the obelisk destroyed by a blaster while they're shooting you?.

    I think bias for Barik is over taking your writing here.

    • Barik, the loadout you posted here is different from your guide, and the flak (which I'm assuming you're talking about the ranked competitive discord server flak) is warranted given that you're only using your turrets to block projectiles on your guide, meanwhile, hitscanners will hit you instead and not the turrets.

    Your loadout for inara explains why you don't get results, and her being boring to you is just your opinion, I like bullying enemies with inara at the start of every round when I off tank with my entire team and sponge up all the damage and live to see the point being captured.

    If boring was a reason not to play someone in ranked, Jenos from last split would've never been picked right? he only rotates 3 marks and gets to ult once per round, that's pretty much it.



  • Nice down vote, here take this picture

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/703226135395434599/715118802224021565/unknown.png

    Dia+ only, Inara, Mother's grace 88% pick rate and 50% win rate
    TG is only picked 10% of the time so the 57% WR obviously due to lower sample size.

    TG is a throw talent most of the time, you can ask your damage or support to help burst down the obelisk and boom, Inara has no talent anymore.
    The obelisk has 1500 HP or 1950 effective HP if it was buffed by Earthen Guard, meaning that at the very start of the game with no bulldozer, a support + Barik will take down the obelisk in 2 seconds or less, a dps + Barik will take down the obelisk in 1 second (Viktor at range does about 1200/s) or about 1.5 seconds.

    are you saying 2 seconds of crippling someone on the point is good?
    the entire purpose of this talent is what ShadowPuppy explained, blocking an entrance by hiding the obelisk behind the door, but guess what, you don't have the incredible sustain on Earthen Guard anymore, late game, Barik would buy Bulldozer and 2 shot your obelisk (1600 in 2s).



  • @maczerofun said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    , meaning that at the very start of the

    You obvously dont know how to use warders field. Like not even remotely at all. Its field is massive you dont need to place it in bariks face. It comical to see post like this when its increadably easy to get value out of the totum when places correctly.



  • @maczerofun said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    Dia+ only, Inara, Mother's grace 88% pick rate and 50% win rate
    TG is only picked 10% of the time so the 57% WR obviously due to lower sample size.

    There are 2188 matches with TG at Diamond+ so the 57% WR is probably significant.


  • PC

    @maczerofun said in Choosing a Point Tank:

    Dia+ only, Inara, Mother's grace 88% pick rate and 50% win rate
    TG is only picked 10% of the time so the 57% WR obviously due to lower sample size.

    Yeah because that can be gleaned from what exactly? Plus the source of this data doesn't agree with you in the slightest. The confidence interval of the graph says that at the lowest its winrate in D+ would be likely to go down to with the data is 54%. A talent in general somehow being bad when it has the second highest winrate in D+ is laughable anyways.

    Also, 50% is really low in D+. The average is around 50% so what you say about MG being really good and Inara being better than Barik or Term point wise is utterly ridiculous since both have way higher winrates overall. Heck all three of Terms talents have a higher winrate than MG and both of Barik's talents have fairly high winrates, with Architectonics having the highest winrate of all tank talents in the entire game at Diamond+.

    I'm not even go over the rest of the posts because there's just too much laughably ridiculous nonsense there. Like worse than this bad. I mean yet again a post that says Inara is better than Barik in and of itself is downright ridiculous, so... It doesn't help your case that you seem to believe your utter nonsense so much you're willing to go after a perfectly fine post because "it doesn't match my opinion that's clearly fact REEEEEE."

    Source:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1g05xgJnAR0JQXzreEOqG-xV5cd0izx67ZvOTXMZe_Zg/edit#gid=1304931604

    And yes although these statistics don't always present an accurate picture of the game, they do present the closest it can with a single statistic. It does, for example, contradict mine and from my experience the popular opinion that Term is the strongest tank in the game, but it also seems to say people play the meta talent and don't understand the character. Which just proves to me he's more mechanical than he appears to some people who just say "he's broken and super easy" when that simply isn't the case. Not to mention anyways that none of this is based on fact nor do I pretend it to be, and there really is no objective way to say anything on this topic even if there's some opinions that make no sense whatsoever. Like Inara somehow being better than Barik and Term both. With MG that has a significantly lower than average winrate nonetheless. And all the large sample size proves to me is that it's situational at best but somehow extremely popular.



  • @Dusklicious The opinion that the Crippling Warder is bad comes from the pro-player content creators I think. Vex30, RandomNoob and so on. The MG winrate jumped to 52% btw. In the end it's probably situational. Against Burn Monster the Warder is not so strong while Mothers Grace can counter it. Against running Raum the warder is great.