Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.



  • @Dusklicious said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    She's low because she's so easy for any hitscan to adequately deal with and she's pretty much countered by half decent positioning. Even Dredge is far better because at least he does good damage... She does by far the lowest output of any blaster in the game.

    She has excellent winrates at Diamond and Masters though, shouldn't high rank players be capable of half decent positioning?

    @schachmaty said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    Barik below Inara: He feels really easy to kill for a tank, especially for hitscan characters, he's so easy to headshot. And his damage output is terrible too, 100 dmg anywhere other than close range

    Wiki says: Has dynamic damage fall off of 85. Damage is reduced up to 50% at maximum range.

    So Barik's damage should never be below 250 for a full hit. He can do headshots and his turrets do extra damage.


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    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    So Barik's damage should never be below 250 for a full hit. He can do headshots and his turrets do extra damage.

    That doesn't necessarily work like that, although what they are saying here is completely ridiculous nonetheless.

    The thing is his damage is divided into 13 pellets, each of them doing roughly 38.5 damage. At longer ranges it's much more unlikely to hit all the pellets on a single target, and you will deal less damage because of that.

    The problem with his assessment isn't that, but it's the fact you aren't going to always engage people from range anyways. Normally in fact you should try to get as close to the enemy as is safe to do because of that very factor. And that drop-off doesn't somehow make Barik's damage abysmal. In fact, back when Better Meta was up, it always showed Barik in the top 3 damage-wise for tanks even at his worst. AtM he's at the least 2nd in terms of damage output. Not only because the picture painted by the argument made there is misleading, but because he has three pretty solid sources of damage in his kit. Whereas on average Inara does like half the damage Barik does.


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    After 3.4 came out I've started realizing a few things wrong with this list, and here's my current revised version as my suspicions about a potential pocket meta are coming more and more into focus:

    Personal 3.4 Tier List.jpg

    I would make individual, paragraph-length comments for most of the shifts, but I'll just keep it brief:

    Most ALL of the shifts: Effects of Corvus' new position in the meta. There's a reason he's banned out now in most comp games. He benefits characters he can either easily use to protect himself or easily pocket, but hurts others in the process. He is the new best support in the game, from all indications. A bit early to say, but yeah. He could be a lower high or even high tier now.

    Also Moji: nerfs didn't go through, also benefits from Corvus.



  • I tried the new Fernando Aegis build and so far it seems to work quite well. The shield can be used as self-heal now. Especially in solo fights against flanks this can be very effective. Tanknando might become more popular after a while also since Khan plays Storm-of-bullets now.
    Grohk heal also feels better now. He can heal a similar amount as other supports (with both ammo cards) and combined with good damage, ult and 40% speed buff he might become a viable main support.

    Wow, you raised Moji FOUR tiers? Didn't she get nerfed?. 😈


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    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    I tried the new Fernando Aegis build and so far it seems to work quite well. The shield can be used as self-heal now. Especially in solo fights against flanks this can be very effective. Tanknando might become more popular after a while also since Khan plays Storm-of-bullets now.
    Grohk heal also feels better now. He can heal a similar amount as other supports (with both ammo cards) and combined with good damage, ult and 40% speed buff he might become a viable main support.

    Wow, you raised Moji FOUR tiers? Didn't she get nerfed?. 😈

    Tanknando can work from my experience, but it has its issues. It does less damage than other point tanks, and it also seems to not work as well in ranked as it does in casuals. Pretty early to tell, but it doesn't really seem good enough to compete with the main three point tanks in most situations.

    I still don't really see Grohk being good really happening especially with pocket supports being the go-to in Plat/Dia ranked at least my experience. It also doesn't help that this patch is actually a nerf to damage Grohk. But yet again I haven't really experienced the new Grohk buffs and it's pretty early.

    The spray nerfs aren't on Live. AoC people said so. Plus Corvus being meta makes her honestly stronger this patch. Plus my opinion shifted when I actually had to play against her a few times in ranked. Not only is she way more effective than I'd expected, she's even worth banning on her better maps.



  • @Dusklicious said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    Tanknando can work from my experience, but it has its issues. It does less damage than other point tanks, and it also seems to not work as well in ranked as it does in casuals. Pretty early to tell, but it doesn't really seem good enough to compete with the main three point tanks in most situations.

    I see him as off tank. He is not as good as Ash or Raum but better than Ruckus and Khan and Atlas.


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    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    @Dusklicious said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    Tanknando can work from my experience, but it has its issues. It does less damage than other point tanks, and it also seems to not work as well in ranked as it does in casuals. Pretty early to tell, but it doesn't really seem good enough to compete with the main three point tanks in most situations.

    I see him as off tank. He is not as good as Ash or Raum but better than Ruckus and Khan and Atlas.

    Atlas is kind of a tie I'd say, but definitely better than Ruckus/Khan/Torvald. Atlas now is actually quite viable on maps like Splitstone Quarry.



  • @Dusklicious I haven't seen an Atlas since, I dunno, 20-30 matches. Can't even remember a good Atlas. So that's hard to judge for me.


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    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    @Dusklicious I haven't seen an Atlas since, I dunno, 20-30 matches. Can't even remember a good Atlas. So that's hard to judge for me.

    I've played Atlas a few times during the new patch. Feels better, though in a few of them I've had to solo tank... Which Atlas definitely cannot do.



  • @Dusklicious said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    I've played Atlas a few times during the new patch. Feels better, though in a few of them I've had to solo tank... Which Atlas definitely cannot do.

    What is in my opinion a big advantage for an off-tank to be able to solo if no other tank is picked (or a Ruckus) or the main tank dies or trolls. The fact that if you would have picked Nando instead of Atlas, you'd have done better in this matches, means that Nando is a higher tier than Atlas, if he is not much better as an off tank to compensate for being situational.


  • PC

    After a little while longer playing the patch, here's a revision of my last list:

    Personal 3.4 Tier List.jpg

    Notations-

    Maeve down to Lower High- She's not as strong as Moji or Term are at the moment. She is a really strong character not going to lie, but Terminus can protect a Corvus and keep a pocket comp running quite well on his own solo and Moji, well, what was supposed to be a nerf was actually a buff in the end.

    Io up to Lower High- Io's still really strong, no doubt about it. She's STILL banned in comp, and I still perfectly understand why. Her nerfs weren't only not enough, they barely did anything noticeable in my opinion.

    Andro down to Upper Mid- Andro isn't really thriving right now in my experience. He's a strong character, but there's a lot of ways to deal with him with the current meta characters. Of the top 8 characters, half of them have a good matchup into Andro. Plus he doesn't benefit as much from Pocket meta as does Talus or Koga.

    Koga up to Upper Mid- Why do people think that Koga isn't very good? He is, particularly in a meta like this. Frankly he'd be as high as Andro if I saw more results than I have, but those results are really making Koga look much stronger than his general perception. He also benefits as much as Talus does from Corvus and Jenos pockets...

    Tiberius down spots- Tiberius just doesn't work well with pocket meta. He's still a potentially strong damage, he just isn't very cooperative with the current meta.

    Seris up spots- Frankly, Seris is potentially really strong. She's been consistently underrated, because everybody wants to talk about main supports. She's not a main support, but what she IS, she's a pretty strong off-support with sustain rivaling some frontlines.

    Tyra down spots- Tyra looked pretty promising in theory, but in practice Tyra is just outclassed by Vik and Vivian, and also can't even utilize pockets as well as either of them or other choices (some of which counter her).

    Fernando up to Median Mid- Fernando actually seems a bit better than expected. I've been getting results in games with him recently using shield builds where I got way more damage than I'd expect. Sometimes I've been able to get as much as 120k shields and 85k damage in a 12-ish minute game. He still needs touching up in some places, but he's actually looking like an option now.

    Atlas up spots- Atlas is honestly also looking like a pretty good option on his better maps, as I would have expected. He still needs a little boost, but he can actually do surprisingly well on maps like Fish Market and Stone Keep.

    Sha Lin down spots- Sha did get buffed, but in the end he's actually worse than before. Not only does he not work well with pocket meta, but he also just cannot apply Caut as consistently as other damage champions. He also can struggle against Koga who's been going up recently.

    Khan up to Lower Mid- Ehh, he's viable, I'll say that. He just has to be played the right way and his team has to work with him. But, he's still highly situational and requires coordination that he didn't used to since he got so heavily nerfed.

    Torvald down to Low Tier- He's simply outclassed in this meta by Corvus and Jenos. But of course he's also just a bad character who has no sustain, no mobility, no damage, and even what he has to compensate is easily outclassed by characters with at least one of those three things.



  • Wow. Moji made it in two weeks from trash (upper low) to super star (high tier). 😉


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    @M3RC3N4RI0 said in Tank Main's Speculative 3.4 Tier List.:

    Wow. Moji made it in two weeks from trash (upper low) to super star (high tier). 😉

    Actually she went from top tier to low tier all the way back up to high tier. I thought her nerfs were actually buffs, and now I think they would be nerfs if they were fully implemented, but the important nerf didn't even make it, plus this meta's quite favorable for Moji. Give her a Corvus pocket on Jag and she will tear through a backline pretty easily. That also applies to several other maps. Brightmarsh and Ice Mines probably most notably.



  • It's funny how Torv is hated by everyone. Andrew Chicken is also like: worst champ ever. His winrate is 51%-57% from gold to Diamond what is at least average compared with tanks like Khan who has 48%-49%. The point is that Torv is a support and not a tank and compared with other supports his sustain is excellent. He got 3+2K HP plus 2K recharge, that's 7K compared to the 2K HP of other supports. Jumping on a Torv with bounce house Buck might not work. No Kinessa can one-shot him. Since Torv is always an off-support the double support meta suits him.

    It's hard to compare with Corvus or Jenos as off-supports. Two healer attacked by two flanks will most likely be massacred while a Healer+Torvald combo might survive.


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