Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread



  • Pin this if you can mods. I want this to be a mega thread about the AoC for this year.

    So the AoC meeting happened a couple of days ago. Syberbolt is going to make a video on it, though we do have some topics that we know were discussed.

    Syberbolt

    • his focus is on quality of life fixes and the ui
    • did a survey for the community (link: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSeAd6HX92mE5Nf9JhzHUamaPa3lKLz7mDXTzocezc-3zEhi0A/viewanalytics ) You can't respond anymore, but you can look at the responses. Take a look, it's worth it. It's an idea into the minds of the community, if you care (which I certainly do!)
    • so it's safe to say he isn't focusing on balance (good decision imo)
    • he also isn't focusing on servers/hackers because he says, and I loosely quote "the devs already know about these issues. It's like calling GameStop and complaining about not being able to find a PS5, they know. Also, even if I did bring it up, they'll just say 'we're aware of the issues and are working on it. Next point'" This also bodes well, because it shows that he knows what's a waste of time and what isn't.
    • verdict: Syberbolt knows his strengths and weaknesses, and he can pick his battles. He knows that balance isn't something for him, and I agree. He also knows that server talk is a waste of time. He does better at fixing other aspects with the community, and getting them to engage.

    SterileTick

    alt text

    • going away from balance. Now I find this to be a slight mistake on his end, but I understand his reasoning. Unlike Syberbolt, he's actually pretty good at the game. Like, he's the only good console player. Though most people in the community didn't like balance being the focus. I somewhat agree, but only with bad players. That Silver ranked Switch player from the last AoC will forever be a meme for wanting to nerf Klawga.
    • he seems to be prioritizing quality of life and bad talents. I do agree with bad talents. No talent should be a throw pick, and technically this is sort of balance. But more on the extreme end, such is reworking or buffing outright throw picks, as opposed to fine tuning champions.
    • personally: ranked requirements over quality of life, because that'll eat into Syberbot a bit.

    ParallaxQueen

    parallax 1.png

    parallax 1.2.png

    parallax 1.3.png

    parallax 1.4.png

    • So it's clear that she's focusing on balance and ranked.
    • Maps: I sort of agree about the bans. Honestly, I'm just going to agree with Fishnit and be like "keep the fun maps in the game and keep the unfun maps out of the game." Always keep Serpent Beach, Stone Keep, Brightmarsh, and Ascension Peak in the game. Delete Timber Mill, Shattered Desert, and Fish Market. Though that might be too controversial. lol.
    • item shop balance: all weapons apply stasis affects. Eh, no. I'm sorry, but no.
    • champion balance: I agree with Zhin. That talent is annoying. If nerfing Lian's Eminence, I think having it be a flat 1,000 burst would be the sweet spot. Inheritance doesn't need a nerf, and neither does Lian really. But whatever. Evie needs a buff, but not to 1,900 HP. Makoa needs buffs, so her buffs are a good start. I do agree that Furia needs a buff in her healing. Moji needs much more than that buff. Barik needs more than that nerf. I do agree with her Fernando suggestions, except for Fireball. He's in a decent spot with Scorch, I think the cooldown will be enough, and maybe buff base Fireball to 500, and less cooldown. That would be an indirect buff to Scorch. I agree about him not being cauterizeable in his ult. Grover nitpicking. -_-
    • my opinions: I do like Parallax, but I can see Z1's puppet strings coming out of her shoulders and hands. Not saying that Z1 completely controllers her of course. You can clearly hear her voice (the Lian thing, the Zhin thing, the Fernando thing, the Mal'Damba thing, and the Furia especially). Though you can also tell that he has some influence over her as well. This is good and bad. Z1 is very knowledgeable about the game, but he has a tendency to nitpick.

    Laura (Switch Rep)

    Screenshot_2021-02-27-00-01-38(1)_resized.png

    • Mix of balance and ui: the balance scares me, because she's not high ranked.
    • UI: Bring back old VGS, see status of champions in game, report (lag?) in game, improve training modes and custom, improve ai of bots, change and improve tutorial, improve requirements for classes, implement a Nintendo chat system, implement something that shows the most used talents. I agree with some of this. Report lag in game, yes! I don't want to go on another site to report lag. I do agree about the chat system, vgs, status of champions, etc. I don't agree with improving the ai of bots. It could be exploited because in some cases, it's better for a bad Moji player to leave because bot Moji's are good! lol.
    • Balance: rework Fernando's Formidable talent, buff Buck, nerf Androxus, buff Torvald, buff Atlas, buff Grohk, nerf Zhin. No comment.

    JaimerasPlay

    https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfn7nV6q8U_4PNDBRvYuhOL8na_-iLnmdAfrsrzGcO_u6UlNA/viewform

    • Paladins Subscription: $1.99 or $2.99 a month subscription. So you get an exclusive skin per month, every 3 months is an epic skin, every 5 months is a legendary skin, every 6 months a limited frame, and every 9 months a limited mount.

    alt text An idea with 1 ticket every 3 months for epic skin and 1 ticket every 5 months for legendary.

    L1bra: ???

    Hyuga: ???

    AliveArg: ???


  • PC

    First impressions from this: Did they really just lie about update videos to get votes? Scummy.

    • Syberbolt is better than I expected him to be, but I think from what I know what he's proposing is bordering on a waste of time. The UI as is, is perfectly fine.

    • Sterile is probably the best rep as far as I can tell. He raised a legitimate issue that's of legitimate interest to the community that will heavily affect the game in a positive way. 👍

    • Parallax looks... Meh. Some of her suggestions make no sense. Among the stupid nonsense she suggests: removing ranked map bans, removing damage numbers from invis, pointless Lian changes, Furia buff has no reason to exist, Moji change doesn't fix her in any way, Barik "nerf" does nothing at all, Only Fern change that's good is Fireball in-hand (which is supposed to be in the game already), and Grover change is pointless as well.



  • @Dusklicious alt text

    Now Dusklicious... You really expected L1bra and Hyuga to be making videos? I'm surprised about SterileTick and Parallax though. Not about the videos, well I'm surprised Parallax ain't making videos. I'm just surprised that SterileTick isn't writing on his Twitter, Discord, Reddit, or even here about what was discussed.

    I know that Syberbolt is making a video, but he's under the weather now. He's usually slow on videos anyway due to work and college (I think he's still in college?). It's why they shouldn't rely on him imo. I think Syberbolt should keep on this track actually. He sucks at the game and will likely have bad balance takes. The issue is that several people are also focusing on UI as well.

    I like Sterile as well.

    ParallaxQueen seems a bit like Z1 2.0. Nitpicking, and then not understanding why something is good. Like when Z1 changed Jenos range card. Like sure it makes him not as safe, but that's like not the reason that he's frustrating. He's frustrating because of Luminary. Same thing with Parallax. Grover isn't S tier due to vining on his teammates lol. He's S tier because his cripple kills flanks, has good poke for a support, plus he has high healing that sustains double tanks. Not to mention, the pockets got nerfed which boosted him up. The Lian changes were pointless. It's like, why??? Much like Z1, she doesn't seem to know how to pick her battles. Like is Grover not being able to vine to his teammates going to really improve balance? The Barik nerf does nothing and the Moji change does nothing. The Fernando thing was good. The map thing seems like she wants to not be controversial. I would just go for it. Fishnit said, and I agree, "keep the fun maps in the game and keep the unfun maps out of the game." Controversial, but I agree.

    I'm slightly disappointed in Parallax. I had higher expectations. That Z1 influence really kicking in.


  • PC

    @HeartQueen said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    @Dusklicious alt text

    Now Dusklicious... You really expected L1bra and Hyuga to be making videos? I'm surprised about SterileTick and Parallax though. Not about the videos, well I'm surprised Parallax ain't making videos. I'm just surprised that SterileTick isn't writing on his Twitter, Discord, Reddit, or even here about what was discussed.

    I know that Syberbolt is making a video, but he's under the weather now. He's usually slow on videos anyway due to work and college (I think he's still in college?). It's why they shouldn't rely on him imo. I think Syberbolt should keep on this track actually. He sucks at the game and will likely have bad balance takes. The issue is that several people are also focusing on UI as well.

    I like Sterile as well.

    ParallaxQueen seems a bit like Z1 2.0. Nitpicking, and then not understanding why something is good. Like when Z1 changed Jenos range card. Like sure it makes him not as safe, but that's like not the reason that he's frustrating. He's frustrating because of Luminary. Same thing with Parallax. Grover isn't S tier due to vining on his teammates lol. He's S tier because his cripple kills flanks, has good poke for a support, plus he has high healing that sustains double tanks. Not to mention, the pockets got nerfed which boosted him up. The Lian changes were pointless. It's like, why??? Much like Z1, she doesn't seem to know how to pick her battles. Like is Grover not being able to vine to his teammates going to really improve balance? The Barik nerf does nothing and the Moji change does nothing. The Fernando thing was good. The map thing seems like she wants to not be controversial. I would just go for it. Fishnit said, and I agree, "keep the fun maps in the game and keep the unfun maps out of the game." Controversial, but I agree.

    I'm slightly disappointed in Parallax. I had higher expectations. That Z1 influence really kicking in.

    It seems like we once again have reps who give me the idea that I, as a DIAMOND LEVEL PLAYER, know balance way better than they do. Even Parallax's takes are ridiculous especially for being so close with a GM player (who, uhh, isn't immune to being bad at the game actually. He threw as Moji (why I will never know) in one of my Plat level ranked games so).

    Speaking of balance takes I should post an outline of my own ideas for 4.3 balance.



  • I just want the moji buff



  • I don't care about AoC but I am very displeased by almost all of what Parallax suggested to the balance. Why would all abilities coming out of weapon be considered a "weapon shot". This complicated too much and buffes things that don't deserve buffs such as Imani's inferno cannon which would become absolutely broken.

    Weapon shots are easily defined: All LMBs, all non-cd RMBs that consume ammo, otherwise all abilities that are stated to be weapon shot in the description. Why make it so inconsistent.

    Why cassie ult would even be affected by resilience wtf. It is not a CC and is already below average....

    So does she want to nerf that Seris card or update the description? I can't tell and if they would cut it in half there would be 0 reasons to use it. It would be that bad.

    Imagine calling 4 cooldowns of Koa hook a "small" cd buff...

    Cherish buff.. do I need to say more?

    Some things are great like making Light Forge card activate only when her beam is on cooldown. I hope she realizes that this should be fixed for all season3+ cards because all cards introduced in that patch work like this one...

    The stealth changes are stupid. They literally added those number ticks with the intention of what she is against lmao.

    While we're at Imani bugs, how about the bug that makes Imani immortal during her ult (easily reproducable) and how her cannon doesn't work half of the time? thx.



  • @TTraw AoC is pretty much what they want and what the community wants. GOOD AoC is 50% what I want and 50% what the community wants. NORMAL AoC is 75% what I want and 25% what the community wants. L1bra/Z1/Parallax are 99% what I want and 1% what the community wants.

    Yeah, I don't know what the fuck is up with Parallax. Like, why??? Her and Z1 nitpick shit that doesn't need to be nitpicked. Like you have an Overwatch style shield meta, simply because the devs think that nerfing the item shop is a smart thing to do. We have broken as fuck Barik and Yagorath. Flanks are in a bad spot, aside from Maeve/Androxus/Zhin/Vora. We have talents that are outright throw picks. We have champions so defined by one ability, that a nerf shot them from S tier to B and C tier (Luminary Jenos and Goddess Blessing Io). Yet she focuses on making Lian's card proct on killing blows, nerfing Seris Spirit Leech filler card, and stopping Grover from vining to his teammates? Yes Parallax, among all the shit I listed above, Grover vining to his teammates is what is truly breaking this game. /s



  • @Dusklicious said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    @HeartQueen said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    @Dusklicious alt text

    Now Dusklicious... You really expected L1bra and Hyuga to be making videos? I'm surprised about SterileTick and Parallax though. Not about the videos, well I'm surprised Parallax ain't making videos. I'm just surprised that SterileTick isn't writing on his Twitter, Discord, Reddit, or even here about what was discussed.

    I know that Syberbolt is making a video, but he's under the weather now. He's usually slow on videos anyway due to work and college (I think he's still in college?). It's why they shouldn't rely on him imo. I think Syberbolt should keep on this track actually. He sucks at the game and will likely have bad balance takes. The issue is that several people are also focusing on UI as well.

    I like Sterile as well.

    ParallaxQueen seems a bit like Z1 2.0. Nitpicking, and then not understanding why something is good. Like when Z1 changed Jenos range card. Like sure it makes him not as safe, but that's like not the reason that he's frustrating. He's frustrating because of Luminary. Same thing with Parallax. Grover isn't S tier due to vining on his teammates lol. He's S tier because his cripple kills flanks, has good poke for a support, plus he has high healing that sustains double tanks. Not to mention, the pockets got nerfed which boosted him up. The Lian changes were pointless. It's like, why??? Much like Z1, she doesn't seem to know how to pick her battles. Like is Grover not being able to vine to his teammates going to really improve balance? The Barik nerf does nothing and the Moji change does nothing. The Fernando thing was good. The map thing seems like she wants to not be controversial. I would just go for it. Fishnit said, and I agree, "keep the fun maps in the game and keep the unfun maps out of the game." Controversial, but I agree.

    I'm slightly disappointed in Parallax. I had higher expectations. That Z1 influence really kicking in.

    It seems like we once again have reps who give me the idea that I, as a DIAMOND LEVEL PLAYER, know balance way better than they do. Even Parallax's takes are ridiculous especially for being so close with a GM player (who, uhh, isn't immune to being bad at the game actually. He threw as Moji (why I will never know) in one of my Plat level ranked games so).

    Speaking of balance takes I should post an outline of my own ideas for 4.3 balance.

    I mean, we have Parallax who thinks that among Yagorath, Overwatch shield meta, flanks and hitscans being in a bad spot, and Luminary Jenos being a shit design, the thing that breaks this game is Grover being able to vine to his teammate. Also, why does she and Z1unknown have such a hate boner against Grover? I really don't get it. 😕



  • @HeartQueen Guys, I don't think they're complaining that Grover's Vine is op, they probably want this change because of all the times you're trying to vine to a far place but a teammate runs in front of you and you waste your ability to move half an inch forward.



  • Me waiting on the English speakers to talk about what was discussed at the meeting:

    alt text



  • @HeartQueen You made me laugh pretty good.


  • PC

    @HeartQueen said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    @Dusklicious said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    @HeartQueen said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    @Dusklicious alt text

    Now Dusklicious... You really expected L1bra and Hyuga to be making videos? I'm surprised about SterileTick and Parallax though. Not about the videos, well I'm surprised Parallax ain't making videos. I'm just surprised that SterileTick isn't writing on his Twitter, Discord, Reddit, or even here about what was discussed.

    I know that Syberbolt is making a video, but he's under the weather now. He's usually slow on videos anyway due to work and college (I think he's still in college?). It's why they shouldn't rely on him imo. I think Syberbolt should keep on this track actually. He sucks at the game and will likely have bad balance takes. The issue is that several people are also focusing on UI as well.

    I like Sterile as well.

    ParallaxQueen seems a bit like Z1 2.0. Nitpicking, and then not understanding why something is good. Like when Z1 changed Jenos range card. Like sure it makes him not as safe, but that's like not the reason that he's frustrating. He's frustrating because of Luminary. Same thing with Parallax. Grover isn't S tier due to vining on his teammates lol. He's S tier because his cripple kills flanks, has good poke for a support, plus he has high healing that sustains double tanks. Not to mention, the pockets got nerfed which boosted him up. The Lian changes were pointless. It's like, why??? Much like Z1, she doesn't seem to know how to pick her battles. Like is Grover not being able to vine to his teammates going to really improve balance? The Barik nerf does nothing and the Moji change does nothing. The Fernando thing was good. The map thing seems like she wants to not be controversial. I would just go for it. Fishnit said, and I agree, "keep the fun maps in the game and keep the unfun maps out of the game." Controversial, but I agree.

    I'm slightly disappointed in Parallax. I had higher expectations. That Z1 influence really kicking in.

    It seems like we once again have reps who give me the idea that I, as a DIAMOND LEVEL PLAYER, know balance way better than they do. Even Parallax's takes are ridiculous especially for being so close with a GM player (who, uhh, isn't immune to being bad at the game actually. He threw as Moji (why I will never know) in one of my Plat level ranked games so).

    Speaking of balance takes I should post an outline of my own ideas for 4.3 balance.

    I mean, we have Parallax who thinks that among Yagorath, Overwatch shield meta, flanks and hitscans being in a bad spot, and Luminary Jenos being a shit design, the thing that breaks this game is Grover being able to vine to his teammate. Also, why does she and Z1unknown have such a hate boner against Grover? I really don't get it. 😕

    They discovered the hyper mega broken strategy of going bouncing house buck + evie + flying inara + beta bk (or alpha was it?) + grover attached to inara rushing into the enemy backlane and are nerfing it accordingly. Amazing job.



  • https://twitter.com/syberbolt/status/1367259392794628099

    AoC Syberbolt video coming in a few days. Can't wait. 🙂



  • So I'm going through different discords that I can see:

    SterileTick

    Evie

    • Person on Discord: what did you focus on?
    • SterileTick: Bad talents like I said I would. ... The ones I focused were Reso Ying, SB Furia, OtM Evie, UF Atlas and Lum Jenos
    • Adanas reply: "I think Evie in general is a fairly consistent Champion (performance and where she is) in the grand scheme we wouldn’t want to change her too much.I think this is something we can look at, but we also had players complain when we removed Over the Moon initially."
    • Neco reply: "If the talent doesn't do anything it's definitely worth looking into."

    Atlas

    • Sterile Tick: for UF they liked the idea of it detonating after second chance ends, but it'll be difficult to implement from a programming perspective because when second chance ends is a variable, rather than a set time due to continuum shift

    Furia

    • SterileTick: For SB they kind of blew it off because they don't like the idea of champions having a "correct" way to be played, but they'd maybe look into cherish being integrated into basekit.

    Ying

    • Neco: "Something interesting about this, I think you’re right in the nature that she has 2 dmg centric talents. I think it would be useful to identify directions that we think could be explored for Ying based on what’s fun or useful to do with Ying."
    • SterileTick: My proposals were Ult oriented talents, which they seemed to like:
      ii.Complete talent rework, Illusory Breach: Ying’s Ultimate charge is increased by 25% but the duration of Illusory Rift is decreased to six seconds.
      iii.Complete talent rework, Believe in Yourself!: Illusory Rift is no longer affected by Cauterize, but its duration is decreased to four seconds,and Ying’s Ultimate Charge rate is decreased by 25%.

    I don't like either of those ideas. Ult talents are generally bad, or they could be unfun like Guillotine Zhin. I personally think Life Like should return, and base illusion buffs (healing for 250 per second instead of 420 every 1.6 seconds)

    Jenos

    • Sterile Tick: For Luminary, everyone is unanimous, devs and community alike that it needs to go, and soon. How that will be done is still being discussed.


  • Nah, we wait on Syberbolt's video. Luckily, SterileTick told us what they discussed at the meeting. Parallax, Hyuuga, and L1bra have yet to speak up, or even seem to plan on speaking up.



  • Screenshot (454).png

    Parallax is saying the other members have videos as well. To that I ask:

    where are they.jpg


  • PC

    @HeartQueen said in Assembly of Champions 2021 Discussion Thread:

    Screenshot (454).png

    Parallax is saying the other members have videos as well. To that I ask:

    where are they.jpg

    I see zero videos for the meeting so either she's lying or nobody's made them yet, which must make them pretty lazy and bad for the job.


  • Moderator



  • It might be biased since it was his own video but how was Syberbolt of all people the one with the most resonable, thought out and prepared topics ? 😅



  • @Dusklicious To be fair, SterileTick told us about his topic on his Discord. As for everyone else, it's not looking too good tbh. https://forums.hirezstudios.com/paladins/topic/5759/assembly-of-champions-2021-discussion-thread/14


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